Christina Goswiller on Social’s Seat at the Table

A candid, wide-ranging conversation with Christina Goswiller, Head of Social Transformation at Digitas, covering her path from startup hustle to agency leadership, how she thinks about social today, and what it’s like to operate in a role that now has a seat at the table.

Highlights:

• How Christina’s career path shaped how she operates today
• Why social earned more influence inside agencies over time
• What surprised Adam about her background and mindset

EPISODE 57 TRANSCRIPT

Adam Katz
Welcome back to Breaking Through the Mayhem for another really, really exciting episode with a friend of mine named Christina Goswiller. Tell us a little bit about yourself. Thanks for joining us today.

Christina Goswiller
Yeah, thanks for having me. So I work at Digitas currently. I head up our social transformation team over there, but I have really a mixed bag of experience.

I've been start-up side, in-house at different brands, agencies, other places. And I think where I'm at today is really this convergence of social, brand, content, creator. It's this emerging space now for 10, 15 years, but I think ultimately we're seeing it have a bigger and bigger influence on CMOs, CEOs.

It is top of mind, and that's super exciting. So I'm excited to be here and talk about all that.

Adam Katz
That's awesome. I mean, you're living in a world now where everybody cares, obviously, about this intersection of brand, culture, content, right?

Christina Goswiller
Absolutely.

Adam Katz
And I'm sure you're living being asked so many different questions about this every day. What do you think are the most experiential things that you've done that have helped shape the way you think about this? And where do you kind of consider social's role today in your business and in business in general?

Christina Goswiller
Yeah. I mean, I think for me, something that I've observed increasingly is that social teams in particular, we used to be this kind of thing that was at the bottom of the conveyor belt, right? Strategy was set by brand people, and then it went to media people, then creatives, and we were kind of along for the ride at the end to provide insight as to the platforms and whatever else, formats, specs, all of that good stuff.

And I think one of the biggest paradigm shifts that has happened and that should have happened a while ago is that social is now an input into all of that because it is kind of the epicenter of culture, right? That is where new music is being shaped, fashion, style, I mean, you name it, right? And so social has become this critical source of intelligence that ultimately should be inspiring brand, media, creative, all of the other things in our kind of ecosystem.

And I think the clients that really live and breathe that are excelling as a result. They're relevant. They are staying attuned to what consumers, communities care about, and that's ultimately, again, the key to success.

Adam Katz
Yeah, I mean, that's why I'm always so interested in talking with the amazing team over at Digitas because you guys, this is what you live by, right? And you guys think about speed of culture, putting brands in the right place at the right time, and you've always been about speed.

Christina Goswiller
Yes.

Adam Katz
Obviously, there's this thing called SWAT, right, that you kind of see out there. And you're doing a lot with this AI and social intelligence world, right?

Christina Goswiller
Absolutely.

Adam Katz
Obviously, that annoying question, I'm sure you got a lot. How is AI changing now, how you're thinking about brands uncovering and acting on these cultural insights?

Christina Goswiller
Yeah. I mean, it's really, I think, just like accelerating everything we're doing. We, at the moment, are really trying to leverage partners and platforms to aggregate the best data sources in the world that help us better understand culture and our consumers and different categories, et cetera, and aggregate that in a way where we can more quickly discover trends that are hyper relevant to your category or community, et cetera.

So it's really just kind of supercharging what we're already doing. And all of that, again, is powering our ability to be a critical input into any brief. We've got a whole suite these days of AI agents that are designed to help us uncover new trends, better understand what's popping with Gen Z and whatever else.

And we've got plenty of people who know that inside and out. It's more just, again, getting to some of those answers a bit faster.

Adam Katz
So cool. I mean, you guys have always been forward thinking, playing with agents, being ahead. But it still seems, no matter how ahead you are, that brands seem to struggle to act on this data.

Christina Goswiller
Yeah.

Adam Katz
What do you think separates the companies that can turn this insight into impact from those that don't?

Christina Goswiller
Yeah. I think it's really about buying into this idea that social is no longer just a channel. It is, again, a source of inspiration for anything and everything.

And some of our clients have really embraced this, have shaken up the way that they structure teams as a result. So more kind of like hybrid skill sets that they're hiring and looking for, but then breaking up some of these kind of traditional structures of strategy, creative media, whatever, in service of bringing together the right skill sets. And people who are inherently curious and excited about what their fans, the brand's fans, consumers care about, ultimately.

And using that as, again, the impetus for partnerships, really any decision, any experience. And I think it, again, comes down to living and breathing that in a way that not everybody's maybe ready to do or is starting to embrace fully.

Adam Katz
It's, I mean, it's so fascinating to watch. And I feel like with your mindset and the way you guys think, you've been sitting at the center of this for a while.

Christina Goswiller
Yeah.

Adam Katz
But as you start to think about search and discovery, they're shifting, obviously, really fast.

Christina Goswiller
Absolutely.

Adam Katz
And towards, especially social, but other formats of seeing where a brand shows up.

Christina Goswiller
Right.

Adam Katz
Like, how would you start to help, like, I was thinking about this earlier, how to ask you this, and I've been trying to play around with it, but like, how do you think about educating brands in today's world?

Like, you're obviously a subject matter expert on this and you want them to think like you think. What do you do when it comes to education?

Christina Goswiller
Yeah. I mean, I think one of the ways, one source of education that we currently provide, which is, I think, simultaneously fun and insightful, is we provide what we call a SWAT culture briefing to brands. And I think traditionally, you know, that might have been something that like, you know, a social media marketer alone would be leveraging as like, all right, these are the, you know, trends, memes I need to be on top of and, you know, inspiration for content specifically for social.

And it's like, no, like that is, you know, gold that should be inspiring your next big like 360, you know, tentpole campaign or whatever it is. So I think the more that people of all levels at all levels can become familiarized with that type of, you know, information and inspiration, like that is where it's at, you know. And so that is, I think, increasingly a tool that we're seeing used and seeing as, you know, something that is helpful to see sweet all the way down, you know.

And then, you know, I think beyond that to like really trying to center a lot of the kind of, you know, expertise we provide, like reframing it to CMOs, CEOs, et cetera, in a way where it's like, ultimately, how can your brand provide more value to like your consumer, right? Like in the era of this new era of discovery, like your job is to provide better answers to people and your brand is part of that answer. And I think like with that as a North Star, like the rest of it kind of makes sense and falls into place a little bit in my mind, you know.

Adam Katz
That's brilliant. Yeah. Coming out of this, I'm going to just start winning everywhere with that storyline.

Come on, Adam. Like you really had to take my pitch.

Christina Goswiller
Yeah.

Adam Katz
I think it's really smart because ultimately, right, every interaction that brands have today is looked at, monitored, and thought about, right? It's crazy.

Like sometimes I always think about, you know, what I'm going to post somewhere. And I have such a bad read sometimes on what's going to actually land and what's not. So, it's always interesting to like pay attention to, you know, the sentiment or the relevance or who the audience is today, right?

Right, right. Speaking of that, you know, what made me want to interview in the first place, outside of like being cool, is I just saw that you were named a top 50 innovator in the creator economy for 2020.

Christina Goswiller
Yeah.

Adam Katz
How does that happen? Like how do you go from like a D1 college athlete to that? You know, and what do you think, how do you think that played out?

Obviously, your competitive spirit or what that means to you, but like tell us a little bit more about you. Like you're winning all these awards. You know, you're staying humble.

You're staying moving. Like what inspires you to do all that and how does that typically happen?

Christina Goswiller
Yeah. You know, I think, you know, the D1 athlete thing like that being very much always in my bloodstream. You know, I am very much a hustler and self-starter.

And funny enough, after graduating, I was working as a paralegal. I was very much about being a lawyer. I wanted to be like a clerk for Supreme Court justice and was studying constitutional law and, you know, I was that nerd.

It was great. But I kind of had a little bit of a come to Jesus moment working as a paralegal and I took a part-time job at what was at the time like barely even a real company called Tribe. And it was just two co-founders who had kind of stumbled into influencer marketing.

And this is circa 2012. Like, you know, they were kind of starting to ride, you know, the wave of all of this becoming this huge movement. And they hired me to basically do some part-time copywriting.

And I parlayed that into a full-time role, you know, quit my job as a paralegal. And just, you know, I've been self-taught basically ever since. I was put in charge of marketing and had no idea what the hell that meant.

So I, you know, was reading textbooks and articles, downloading the syllabus from like, you know, my alma mater Stanford's graduate school business program.

Adam Katz
I haven't heard the word syllabus in a while.

Christina Goswiller
That's a good thing. Nobody wants to hear that word.

Adam Katz
I was the type of person who just showed up for the syllabus and that was the end of it.

Christina Goswiller
The world needs both, Adam. That's the thing. No, you know, I think and like that is who I am.

Like I've always been a self-starter. And like once I get excited about something and I'm hungry, I'm going to go figure it out. And, you know, I think that was my introduction to brand strategy, to influencer marketing, to social media, all of those things.

You know, and fast forward how many years later now, I'm in this role at Digitas where like, you know, I'm given the opportunity to design new products and solutions and services based on that expertise. And I think, you know, that aligns very nicely to my kind of, you know, D1 athlete hustler mentality, but also entrepreneurial background and spirit from, you know, those early days at Tribe. And yeah, it feels kind of like the perfect, you know, just full circle moment of it, I guess.

Adam Katz
That's awesome. I mean, you know, from my perspective, first of all, where'd you grow up?

Christina Goswiller
I grew up in L.A. in Manhattan Beach.

Adam Katz
So it's... Stanford's not too...

Christina Goswiller
Yeah, I've come back to L.A. too. So another kind of full circle moment.

Adam Katz
Was Stanford like your aspiration growing up or did that, like, is that where you wanted to end up?

Christina Goswiller
It was. So as like, you know, an athlete that was a full-time job as a kid, even to travel ball and all those things, I always knew I wanted to, you know, use softball to get myself to a really, really good, you know, both athletic program as well as like academic, you know, institution. So Stanford was kind of like the pivotal of like, you know, great, obviously, like athletic program, great, you know, kind of sports history and then, you know, amazing school.

Adam Katz
You were at... I feel like you were at Stanford when Michelle Wee came around.

Christina Goswiller
I was. I was. She was, yeah, a frequent flyer in the PT room when I was in L.A. too, like having my shoulder worked on or something. So yeah. And Andrew Luck was another one. Lots of like high profile, you know, some cool athletes at that time.

Yeah.

Adam Katz
I mean, because Michelle Wee really, when women's sports started to get the publicity it deserved.

Christina Goswiller
Right.

Adam Katz
Obviously, she didn't get where she ultimately was hoping.

Christina Goswiller
Yeah.

Adam Katz
But I feel like she made a huge impact.

Christina Goswiller
Oh, absolutely.

Adam Katz
On that, because like there was so much spotlight, I remember, on her as a sports fan. And yeah, it's pretty cool. I mean, it's awesome that you ended up where you wanted to be.

Christina Goswiller
Yeah.

Adam Katz
So I think, you know, from my perspective, like listening, you know, obviously athlete, always competitive spirit, and then finding where you did today. Like what is your typical advice for people in careers that you think about when you're talking to them?

Christina Goswiller
Yeah. You know, I think something I really benefited from, you know, in kind of my early days out of school working at a startup was that I had exposure to a lot of different things, like right off the bat. And there was this kind of like, I had to figure it out.

You know, like I was doing like, I was cold calling people. I was like, you know, like really like all manner of things. Like at one point they were going to get me like a difficult computer purely to like work with an Excel spreadsheets all day.

Like, you know, like the full gamut of things. And what I would say is like.

Adam Katz
You're a utility player at all times.

Christina Goswiller
Yeah. You know, and any opportunity that's going to give you, you know, cross train you right off the bat, but also give you a good sense of what you like and don't like is kind of unbeatable. And also, I think, program you in a way where, you know, you are able to problem solve through things that you've never done before.

Like, you know, I think a little bit of a kind of inherent bias I have when I'm interviewing people even now is like, you know, when I see that in someone, I get really excited because that is how I think, you know, of like say like just hearing no isn't good enough. Like, let's go figure out how to actually accomplish what we want to accomplish and like be a bit scrappy, for lack of a better way of saying it. And yeah, you know, I think that's very much how like SWAT came to be of like, you know, we needed we knew we needed to have like content creators in house.

That was kind of where it started. And nobody had done that yet, at least not at Digitas. And there was there were a lot of like not, you know, for other any other reason than like legal, you know, kind of implications and whatever else.

Like there were a lot of like obstacles in the way that we as like a small Tiger team were like, nope, we're going to figure this out.

Adam Katz
I love that. Yeah, I mean, you know, from my perspective, when I think about where I want to take this with you is always like, you know, we obviously think about cultural moments, as you said earlier, and kind of how you marry these things together. What's like the coolest moment you want to be a part of one day that you haven't been?

Christina Goswiller
Oh, goodness. That's a great question. You know, I think, maybe different answers personally and professionally.

Professionally, like, definitely setting my sights on some bigger stages, you know, like would love to be at Cannes this year and putting that out into the universe. You know, and I think just being those events are always, you know, like a mixed bag of experiences, of course, but I think being around so many people who are excited and fired up about the same things is inspiring, you know, always. I think personally, yeah, you know, I'm really inspired, understandably by what's happening in women's sports these days.

And I think, you know, being able to kind of find, again, some kind of like marriage of like my history with my expertise now, you know, I don't know, being like on the like court side for like, you know, the Sparks one day doing whatever would be pretty damn cool, you know.

Adam Katz
We actually have a signed Caitlyn Clark jersey over there.

Christina Goswiller
Amazing.

Adam Katz
Yeah, well, listen, I'm all about thinking like that, you know, and it feels like with you, based on your career, anything you've put your mind to, you're going to end up. So one day we'll see you. We'll see you doing that.

But, you know, from my perspective, the other thing is you're obviously in L.A., right? And there's a lot going on when it comes to that kind of world. So quick question for you.

You know, I was thinking about like obviously where you're trying to take your career, athletics, all these different things. When was the last time you hit a baseball or a softball? I was going through my head a lot.

Christina Goswiller
Well, it's a great question. It has been too long is the short answer. I, increasingly, I've started bookmarking batting cages in the area because I feel I'm not fully ready.

Like there's this anxiety of like, I'm not going to be as good as I used to be. I know that. But like there's no way I'm just terrible, right?

Adam Katz
Like how many years are we talking since you picked up a bat?

Christina Goswiller
I mean, it's been 10 plus years, almost certainly. I've thrown a ball around a little bit, but like, you know, like seriously gone into a batting cage and like tried to, you know, like it's been a minute.

Adam Katz
So how fast were people throwing?

Christina Goswiller
Well, the thing with softball is it's closer than baseball and not closer. And so, you know, by the time like a softball pitcher releases the ball, because you're also jumping forward, they're like, you know,

Adam Katz
25 feet away

Christina Goswiller
Yeah, exactly. So I think like the best pitchers were like high 60s, low 70s, you know, and throwing rise balls, which is something that doesn't exist in baseball, you know, and like the reaction time is negative.

Adam Katz
I got to look up your stats after this call. Maybe I'll do it right now as we're talking.

Christina Goswiller
No, no, no.

Adam Katz
Any, any runs I'm going to see there?

Christina Goswiller
Um, you know, what's funny, my very first at bat, I hit what ended up being a double because it hit the top of the wall in the outfield and bounced back in versus back out. And like it might have been a bit of a metaphor in there somewhere.

Adam Katz
I see you are number 33. I found that.

Christina Goswiller
Yes, that was my number.

Adam Katz
We'll dig into it. I always like to ask this question to, you know, fun people. If you can go to dinner with one person, not family, and that is alive, who would it be?

Christina Goswiller
So I just finished listening to Barbara Streisand's biography. I have always been low key obsessed with this woman, but having then spent 1000 pages with her and she, her audio book is she actually, you know, reads it and it's very conversational. And she's got the little like, you know, isms and sound effects along the way.

They're very Barb. Like she I knew she was an icon. I didn't maybe even fully realize the extent to which she had, you know, impacted.

I mean, every industry within entertainment, every microcosm within entertainment and then beyond, you know, the last two chapters of her book were about like, you know, she and Bill Clinton on speed dial basically, you know, and was influencing foreign policy, you know. So anyway, I think she's endlessly fascinating. She lives in Malibu, so she's not that far from where I am in L.A. I might just, you know.

Adam Katz
and she grew up where I grew up.

Christina Goswiller
Yeah, exactly. She's a Brooklyn babe.

Adam Katz
So, yeah, I happen to understand a lot about her as well. OK, growing up around people that would talk about her, but actually, you know, people that went to high school with her.

Christina Goswiller
Oh, yeah, of course.

Adam Katz
Yeah, it's a pretty small world. Well, listen, this was fun. Hopefully you'll join us again, Christina.

Thank you, everyone, for listening today.

Christina Goswiller
Yeah, thank you for having me.