Ad Net Zero Director John Osborn on Why Purpose Is the Most Powerful Media Strategy

What do cowboy ethics, climate-conscious media, and the perfect chocolate chip cookie have in common? For John Osborn, it all comes back to purpose.

In this episode, Sightly CEO Adam Katz sits down with John—Director at Ad Net Zero and longtime industry force—for a no-BS conversation about sustainability, values-driven leadership, and why the future of advertising depends on doing the right thing and doing it well.

Together, Adam and John unpack:

💥 The “cowboy ethic” that fuels stronger partnerships

📊 Why carbon measurement is key to smarter media planning

⚖️ How to balance speed with scalable, lasting impact

👥 Why employees—not execs—are redefining brand values from the inside out

🍪 And yes, the secret to the perfect chocolate chip cookie (crispy edges, gooey middle)

They also dig into Sightly’s role in the movement, the rise of real-time value expression, and a global sustainability framework that could unite the industry around measurable change.

Whether you’re deep in ESG strategy or just getting started, this episode makes one thing clear: purpose and performance can go hand in hand.

TRANSCRIPT

Adam Katz
Welcome to Breaking Through the Mayhem. We're super excited today to have John Osborne, who runs AD Net Zero. Thank you for joining us today.

John Osborn
How are you, Adam? I could not be any better. And I'm pumped to be here with you, man.

Adam Katz
I love that, you know, John and I have an amazing relationship sometimes on the podcast. I'm actually meeting some of these people for the first time. John is somebody that I have known for a long time and I admire. One of the great guys in our industry has done pretty cool things, you know. So tell us a little bit about yourself, John, for the audience that doesn't know you.

John Osborn
Well, thanks, Adam. First of all, huge thanks for having me here. And for those listeners out there. Adam and I first met just over about, I think about a year and a half ago, and it was an interesting first meeting because he checked me up a little bit. He wanted to know my intentions, and it was sort of like, I mean, right off the bat, this is the kind of guy I really like because he's direct.

He doesn't mess around with bullshit, and he's focused and he has values, and that's somebody I can sign up for. So thanks to you for having me, but also thanks for your partnership over the last two years or so. So thanks very much. I also enjoy your show.

Adam Katz
Thank you. Tell us a little about yourself.

John Osborn
I'm John Osborne. What else is there to say now? So I'm John Osborne. A lot of people still call me Ossie, just because I've been in this industry for North of 35 years, if you can believe it. And what I loved about this industry, which I still love about this industry, is that it's people at the core. It's creativity colliding together with business. And that friction creates magic time and time again.

But not just magic in a void, in a vacuum. It's magic that can ultimately propel businesses forward. If the ideas are good enough, relevant enough, focused enough, and if it's got enough, activation and amplification behind it. So I loved advertising. I jumped into it on the creative side of the house back in 1988. I was in college and I was like, this is the kind of career I can absolutely see myself in.

And I got lucky. I got a job right out of college at Saatchi and Saatchi, where I worked on such powerhouse brands, and they are powerhouse brands as Betty Crocker Fruit Snacks, Gold Medal flour. I learned how to bake at a young age. Cookies. I can still make the best desk cookies, chocolate chip cookies in the world and,

And I jumped into it. Yeah, it's not bad man. You can and you can tell you can't see me on this, but you can tell that I like a good chopper.

Adam Katz
Are they more chewy? Are they more.

John Osborn
They are right in the middle. It's got to be right in between. Too crunchy. It all falls apart. Too chewy. It's like, ugh, gross. But this is like the best cookie is a little bit crispy on the outside and nice and fulfilling on the inside. I'll leave it at that.

Adam Katz
How often do you make cookies?

John Osborn
Well, nowadays I'm more of an empty nester. I've got two kids, and they're often in college. They're home now. They just got home this week, so I've been shuttling to and from LaGuardia airport at midnight. But they're both home now, and so the baking will ramp up. But, it's still there. I like cooking cookies every now and then. Maybe that's a statement about life I like. I like making the cookies.

That's an interesting one. So I jumped into it, man, and I jumped into the creative. I was at BBDO, blessed to be with great clients, great people. And I was promoted, about 13 years before I left. So I was the proud CEO of the New York organization for 13 years. And then I started awakening.

My eyes were becoming more open to the power of media. Media done. Right. And I jumped over and I was fortunate enough to win. That's the CEO of OMD for the US network for five years. And then I spun out of there and we started Ad Net Zero, which is, nonprofit trade organization focused on sustainability.

Adam Katz
Wow. How long have you been doing Ad Net Zero now?

John Osborn
For just north of two years. And so we started in February of 2022, and we've now got about 100 organizations. You guys being one Sightly is right there. I see you and your team, Annalise and Maeve and many others at a lot of the events. And it's great to see everybody in action.

So I've been doing it for about two and a half years now.

Adam Katz
That's awesome. Would you say that with the sustainability space, would you have ever thought you were going to be in it? If I was to say in 1988 when you were making cookies, that this would be your role today? Well, what would you say?

John Osborn
You know, yes and no. I definitely couldn't see myself doing this role. I mean, it's hard to see over the horizon line when you're young anyway. You know, you're living in the moment. But I was asked when I was very young, like, if it weren't advertising, what really would you like to do? And I remember this answer and I can stick to it.

I would love to be a weatherman. Like, in the traditional sense. You know, it's sort of like, I know I grew up in Massachusetts, man. And we got like the blizzard of fricking 78. I remember it like it was yesterday. Snow over the height of my mom. I grew up with my mom and lived in a single family household, and I remember going out to shovel the driveway.

And I kid you not, Adam, the snow was over my head and it stuck to me. But then fast forward when I was in business, I've always tried to look for opportunities to give back in meaningful ways. And I joined the Red cross. And so, you know, a lot of that is weather driven, you know, when disasters happen that could be wildfires out west or hurricanes or tornadoes or whatever it may be.

You know, there's a calling, you know, and those first responders that are there when people don't have even a blanket to hold on to, they've lost everything. That moment is so important. And I just remember sort of that feeling I felt of trying to give back and just the relief on the faces of the people, even something as simple as a warm blanket and what that means to them when they've lost everything.

That just kind of propelled my inner sense of what I wanted to stand for from a values perspective, then leading into Ad Net Zero. Now it's wrong to make a comparison between like one weather related event and sustainability. But it does seem to me I'm not a rocket scientist, I'm just an average person. Yes, I've been very blessed.

I've had some very important roles, and I've been blessed to work with great people and great clients. But I just look around and I do see changes in patterns. I see threats to individuals' lives, but I also see threats to supply chains and how business can be done and should be done. I remember after Superstorm Sandy and just the devastation not only to people's lives, but businesses shut down for weeks on end, particularly in lower Manhattan.

So things that disrupt, well, they disrupt. And if I can help, you know, alleviate that or fix that or tend to that, that's kind of a calling for me. So what I like about Ad Net Zero is it's not just that stuff, the fluffy stuff like, that's sort of like, you know, we need to give back.

There's a lot of people that say that and feel that, but there's a real business calling behind it as well, because what we're trying to do is enable more, better, more sustainable business at the end of the day. And I think that's an important sort of reframing, if you will, given the sort of backdrop in the world. These are tricky times, and they're not easy times.

And not for not not times for the faint at heart. But I think businesses that care about this, from a values perspective, they care about tightening up their own supply chains and taking control over it. I think we'll be better positioned in the long run for some of these changes that are happening in the world. So that's kind of my calling and why it connects to me personally.

Adam Katz
So when you guys look for partners, what are you looking for today?

John Osborn
That's a great question. You know what we're looking for for partners that actually deliver on what they say. You know, I have very simple values. And you and I have talked about some of these values. I have one that's called the cowboy ethic, which is that your word is your word.

And if you don't stand by that word, then don't open your mouth. You know, because a lot of people are talking out there and some people don't really necessarily mean what they say. So we're looking for companies that really do care and companies that understand that this is not perfection overnight. This is not like flicking a light switch. It's not immediate, but this is a little bit of a longer game and it's one step in front of the others.

So we're looking, frankly, for partners that don't necessarily know how to take those first steps. They need a little jolt of confidence, some understanding, some enlightenment. So a lot of our focus, particularly for companies on the earlier part of their journeys, is around that education and understanding. But to be clear, it's up to the company to decide whether this is part of their fabric or part of their mission or not.

Like I'm not banging pipes in the street saying, you've got to get on this mission. Like that's not really how I roll. That's not my approach. And my approach is, I think we're here doing important work in this industry. There is no common framework for how carbon emissions should be measured. You can't manage what you can't measure. So job one kind of behind the curtain, if you will.

I'm taking a little bit behind the curtain here to create a framework so that it's not apples and oranges and refrigerators and lions. It's like it's one nomenclature. Now companies can decide how they want to implement that or incorporate that into their business practices. But we can't even as an industry, get out of the starting gate unless there's that framework in place.

And I'm really proud to say that in just a couple of weeks, we'll be announcing that final framework. And then we'll be looking to work more hand-in-hand with companies to incorporate that going forward. So, that's part of what we're focused on right now.

Adam Katz
Congratulations.

John Osborn
Thank you.

Adam Katz
You've been putting in a lot of work to get here.

John Osborn
Trying to. There's some sweat equity in here. You can see the sweat like beating up on my forehead. You're interrogating me. You're interrogating me. No, you’re not.

Adam Katz
You're one of the only that still wears a suit when it's 100 degrees out. So that's your own problem.

John Osborn
I know, I know, I'm working on the wardrobe. No one has ever accused me of being a good dresser. I will just admit that right out of the gate.

Adam Katz
No, it's just because you probably wake up, put on the same suit every single day, and you make sure that it doesn't get wrinkled. So you could just keep re-wearing it. That would be my idea. Listen, you're in a sustainability space. You have to make sure you're using the same suit over and over.

John Osborn
This is one of the hottest trends, man. You're on top of. Look at you, Adam. You're on top of one of the hottest trends in the sustainability sector, which is the reusability of clothing and people that want to buy clothes that were worn like 15 years earlier by some semi-famous person.

There's a whole currency out there right now around this, and we think it's great.

Adam Katz
I've been thinking about that. In terms of like success for brands. How do you look at success? I mean you're talking a lot about a framework. You're talking a lot about them figuring it out. But ultimately a step by step process is obviously the healthiest way to think about anything. People I don't think people buy things that are shoved down their throat.

I think they learn with you. Right. So that's kind of what you're getting at here and a lot of initiatives that have been moved too fast have died or gone the wrong way. And I admire the way you've gone to market in that sense. But how do you then help brands start to do this quicker? Because, you know, the pressure is on those people to come back to their company and show a measured success.

So how do you kind of help the people that are stewarding this within organizations?

John Osborn

Yeah, that's a great question. So our help comes in a number of different ways. And I think that that's a great place to start. Like if I had a lapel pin, it depends on my, on my, on my blazer here it would say hi, my name is John. I'm here to help. And the help comes in a number of different ways. I think help comes in education and understanding and training, but I also think help comes in other ways as well.

One of the things that we spend a lot of time helping companies sort is how to build bridges, let's say inside of an organization, take a big advertiser. Oftentimes sustainability people are kind of on one, metaphorically speaking, on one end of the building. And the marketing folks, for example, are on the other end of the building. And those two sides don't always talk to each other.

And usually there's a moment like it might be in a meeting with the CFO where they're looking at different numbers and someone says, who's looking at the sustainability around the $600 million media spend that we have over here. And then that begins a process, or an agency will get an RFP or an RFI that talks about what that company is doing to sort of interrogate and take a look at their own practices.

But partnership, no one can go far and fast alone. They need the right partners and it's an interesting time. I would say it's a fluid time in this industry right now where new partnerships are forming and cleaner pathways and ecosystems are arising, new companies are being formed in new technologies. You guys, Adam, you and Sightly are on the forefront of developing.

You know, you have an innovation that seems to me is very much a part of your blueprint. So we help companies, you know, build bridges and form partnerships. We also will, if this is important from a corporate standpoint, engage employees. And oftentimes that group is left out of the conversation. But employees give a shit they do. And so when companies form green green teams or, you know, establish employee related programs, that's an important variable as well.

And we lean in there too. But it's really up to the to the company if this is an important value for the company to not only drive profit, but to do it responsibly, do it in a way that employees get on board with, that partners get on board with where they can build bridges and form new partnerships with that is that's that's the zone that we want to be in with these companies.

And we're, you know, we're really lucky to have this trusted relationship.

Adam Katz
I saw the acquisition of Green Bids. What was your opinion on that?

John Osborn
Well it shows that there's activity in the marketplace. I was at a conference DMs by Luma just two days ago, and they announced that deal, between what Perry on and and green bids and it was great to see I don't have any unique insight.

Certainly not one that I can talk about. Sort of peering around, you know, behind what the dynamics were of that. But it was not lost on me that that was a quote, unquote. I mean, it's in their name. Green, a company that is there's activity around which is which is interesting. So I think that we're coming off of a couple of years now where there's this sort of hope and anticipation that the markets would fall and things would start to, you know, happen again.

And then for, you know, things that are out of all of our control, but other things happen and it may delay that or it creates other dynamics. And now like, even as we're sitting here on this call right here, right now, there is activity out there. And I am feeling that in the US market, businesses that are in business around rallying around the right business practices, like there's activity and there's opportunity out there.

You know, it's easy to sit here and say, woe is me and all these challenges. Well, let me tell you the other side of that coin. This is the side of the coin I live on. You know that is optimism. And, you know, there's opportunity out there. Every challenge is an opportunity. And I think companies that approach it from that perspective will be well positioned even in this market.

Adam Katz
I completely agree. I mean, listen, I think the key to what you said is, is accurate. And we definitely stand by. You want to take care of your employees. I think the biggest challenge in a lot of companies leaders try to dictate their values, but I think the employees' values will lead to dance almost every time. You know, we put we have a team that works with you guys all the time in that sense.

John Osborn
Totally.

Adam Katz
I do think one of the big things that I keep thinking about is, you know, we we here at Sightly try to work on helping brands authentically show up in real time, on any category, whether it's sustainability or whatever, through contextual from your perspective, like, why is that become so critical for brands to communicate values with transparency and consistency?

Like where do you kind of see that working out for brands when they lean in.

John Osborn
I think, you know, for every trend there's a counter trend and there's a shit ton of noise out there right now. And I think that that noise, the opposite side of that is people are really searching for truth. And I think the truth in many ways is under assault.

But when you get people thinking about what their true north is, or their inner truth or their values, maybe a better way of saying it, you know, that's an important thing. So I think even against this backdrop, you know, I think that connection is a really important one. But the values connection. And you're right, you mentioned it just a minute ago.

I do see your folks out there , Annalise and Maeve and many others. And it's very clear to me that, you know, they are connecting to you not only from your business opportunity lens, but they're connecting with you because they're on board your mission, you know, they see it as a mission. And I think that's great. You know, that's an accelerant.

That's an X factor, if you will, that is ultimately going to hold you in good stead despite whatever the backdrop is. But the contextualization is really, really important. The contextualization thing you mentioned.

Adam Katz
I think the key, though, is that, you know, you're talking about something that I completely agree with, with you, like when it's all said and done, let's call it what it is.

Everyone's going to have a different perspective on how things have to work out. And I think ultimately you're stewarding the same thing we think about here, which is the brand is going to lead the dance. You're just here to be their therapist along the way or that company.

John Osborn
Oh yeah.
Adam Katz
Looking back on what you said earlier, can you tell us a little bit more about the global media sustainability framework and how it's going to help brands from your perspective?

John Osborn
Yeah, I think it will, because right now, you know, you can't really understand what to measure. And there's a lot of bickering going on behind the scenes as to what everybody thinks they know. Nobody knows shit until they know, is what I would say. And you can't go until you know where I live.

There's a local station that says no before you go, and it's the traffic and the weather report. Here. I am coming back to the weather again. Adam. Maybe that's a meteorologist, but

Adam Katz
I'm like, I'm concerned that tomorrow, like, I'm just going to you're just going to walk away from Ad Net Zero we're just going to see you with a little podcast talking about weather by tomorrow. You know, you're going to be out there doing weather, wearing a short sleeved shirt, making cookies. And you're ready to go.

John Osborn
Exactly.

Adam Katz
Ready to go.

John Osborn
Exactly. Basically, I am a huge goofball is what you're faced with. And it's true, there's a big part of me and I'm perfectly willing to be self-effacing about it. But anyway, know, before you go and you can't. So it's not about where companies start. Okay. That's what I would say.

It's just about improvement. And let's just say my belief is everybody can do a little bit better. And if you don't agree with that, then that's fine. Like, we're not meant to be partners together. But I think generally speaking, most everybody I talk to, even companies and individuals that aren't an official part of Ad Net Zero, they're like, you know what?

We probably can be doing a little bit more. We can probably be cutting waste because less is more in this game when you cut waste and inefficiency and other things like that, that creates more impact and that creates, you know, your dollar, every dollar is stretched further to become that much more, you know, value driven. And that's a really, really good thing.

So for us it's the improvement delta. But you don't even know how to improve. Until companies have a baseline. They can’t establish a baseline until they have metrics and measurement. But if those initial metrics in the measurement, which in marketing and media oftentimes starts around media or production, but increasingly media, then there's no way of even showing what that improvement would be.

So we need truth around what the initial framework will allow us to set from benchmarks. And then companies can decide where they want to go. Even on a campaign by campaign basis. There may be times where they're like, you know, we don't give a shit about sustainability to this. We're going to swing for the fences and go hog wild because we just can't figure it all out.

You know, for this campaign and other campaigns might be like a campaign where they really see a lot of opportunity to cut out a lot of waste and still deliver that same amount of impressions and that same business impact or even enhance business impact, or they'll drive greater brand value. By the way, brand value is another element of this thing.

When corporations and advertisers take a look at what sustainability can mean in terms of unlocking things around, let's say, attention and what attention correlates to for other things, that's an unlock, too. So we're spending a lot of time building these case studies and showing in real life what really the impact is, as opposed to all this, you know, talk in the backdrop.

Adam Katz
I love that. And what keeps you going with all this? I mean, I know you have a great team.

John Osborn
Yeah. Honestly. And this is not a joke. This is like I'm dead serious when I say this. It's just like, I want to leave this world a little bit better, but I want to do it because my kids matter to me more than anything in the world.

Like my kids, my family. It's really important that I don't, you know, I don't feel bad saying that. It's like that's an important part of me and my DNA and, you know, I want to leave the world a little bit better for them. And I'd like it to be, you know, I'd like to look back on my career and say, like, look, in any.

And I look back at BBDO and I look back at OMD and we did great business there. And a lot of times those campaigns that moved businesses further, faster were rooted in some sort of a purpose based agenda. I just see that value equation. So that's something I sign up for.

Adam Katz
That's awesome. Yeah. What else? If you had to pick one person that was alive, that's not your family, who are you going to dinner with?

John Osborn
Oh, that's a great question. I would say, the person has to be alive?

Adam Katz
The reason I say that is because most people, if you ask me, I'm going to my dad who is not around. So like, I want to keep it alive for the reason of not bringing back somebody. But if somebody was alive and not in your family, who would you love to spend time with?

John Osborn
I don't have a great answer for that. I would, you know, the easy one is to go with some sort of a sports personality or a politician or someone like that, but I'm actually trying to think of like, for me, it might be Jim Cantore from The Weather Channel, for God sakes. You know, Jim Cantore

Adam Katz
The fact that I stumped you should be, a guy who can answer anything.

John Osborn
I know, I know because he

Adam Katz
Doesn't have a lapel, doesn't have a story, or doesn't know. I gotcha. Check mate.

John Osborn
You totally did. Because I was going to go with someone who is dead. I was going to go with some, like, you know, Ruth Bader Ginsburg or something like that. And I was like, Yeah.

Anyway, I'll stick with my answer. I love Jim Cantore. Anyone that goes out in the storm puts the hard helmet on, dons the microphone to deliver news to try and keep people a little bit safer. That's the kind of guy you can get behind.

Adam Katz
Wow. I'll close with this. And this may not get released until the series is over. Celtics Knicks Where is this? Where is this ending?

John Osborn
Well, this is a fit. This is perhaps the most controversial topic we've discussed on this podcast, Adam. But, I mean, you know, I grew up in Boston and Boston, born and bred. And after a few beers, you can hear that accent come out, you know, how about them apples? But I will say that the Tatum loss was a big hit for the Boston Celtics.

To me, it seems inevitable this is going to be the Knicks year. I live in New York. I'm not an idiot. I'm going to walk out of this location where I am. I'm going to be amongst a bunch of New Yorkers. So my head is saying New York. My heart kind of Boston, but I don't know. This is the Knicks year.

I just feel it for the Knicks. So I'm going to have to go with the Knicks. I just lost my entire family in my Boston base. But you're stuck with me, Adam.

Adam Katz
You know, it's interesting, I would say last night, we’re recording after game five. I gained a lot of respect for the Celtics last night. That was championship DNA.

That was great. That was yeah. I'm one of the biggest knick fans you will find. But last night I gained a lot of respect for that championship team, a lot of a lot of gritty guys last night coming to play to win that game. It's hard, though, to sustain that without your best player to just have that gritty performance every night, but if the Knicks lose this series, it would be easily the worst loss of my sports career. At this point, I would. I don't think I've won anything, but this would be bad.

John Osborn
Celtics have shown that no lead is safe and no seriously be safe. But I loved the way you work sustainability into that statement.

They may not be able to sustain this sustainability story here. Let's see what happens. By the time people listen to this, they will know the results, but we'll see what happens.

Adam Katz
Listen. Hopefully the Knicks win it all. Listen John, thank you so much for joining us. You are.

John Osborn
Thanks, pal.

Adam Katz
Not only a great leader, a special person and somebody that people should definitely get to know. Thank you so much.

John Osborn
Thanks. I really appreciate you and all your support right back at you.